On the usage of Smoke Grenades

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StRiKeR
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On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by StRiKeR »

Rarely a gamenight goes by these days without some incident in which bad usage of smoke grenades gets people in danger or does the opposite of the intended effect. So lets quickly establish some ground rules on the usage of Smoke Grenades in ArmA before everyone's attention span gets stretched too far. This is concerning using smoke as a view blocker, not a signalling tool.

1. Smoke generally goes on the enemy position, not on your own.

If you fight AI, you want to see them. The AI is better at exploiting that one pixel of a gap to spot you than any of you are. All you are doing is clouding your own vision. Stop. If it's an A&D, you just told everyone on the map where you are and have invited them to shoot in your direction. That's basically the equivalent to high treason.

2. Don't use thrown Smoke Grenades offensively.

See rule one. Too many times I see numpties running across an opening while throwing smokes in front of them. A: You only throw 30m so by the time that smoke has popped you are gonna be well beyond it. B: If you start taking fire (because duh) you can't see where its coming from and have no chance to shoot back accurately. C: All you are doing is decreasing your awareness of the situation while increasing the enemy's.

3. When using thrown smoke defensively, make sure you aren't blinding adjacent squads or assets.

I get that it's a reflex to start popping smoke forward when your squad is getting hammered and you want to fall back. But if there's another squad or tank to your left, trying to bail you out by shooting at the enemy, you just screwed up not only yourself but the guys next to you aswell. Congrats.


So in essence, use thrown Smoke Grenades to mask a fallback or displacement but don't do it if friendlies are trying to resolve the reason you are falling back. Use only fired smoke grenades in an offensive movement, as you can effectively put them on the enemy position at range without showing your own position. I highly encourage all mission makers to use Dmitry's antiFlubber.sqf btw. No excuse to not use it.
Effectively, there are no other reasons to use smoke so think about if you are in one of the two situations the next time you consider using a smoke. In addition, please wait for a Team Leader or Squad Leader to make the decision to employ smokes. Don't just do it because you felt like it as it basically forces your hand as to what actions have to follow.
Cobra.
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by Cobra. »

+1

People seriously need to lessen up on smoke grenades, they are not an answer to everything especially when it comes down to offensively smoking and smoking your own position. Even if you have a man down, throw fucking smoke on the enemy not onto him.
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Eagle-Eye
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by Eagle-Eye »

Basically an ArmA habit because of faulty modelling.

Without the anti-flubber, you never know where the grenade's going to end up, as it could easily (and often does) hit whatever and bounce off meters from where you wanted it. In a weird way, throwing it at your own feet is actually the most sure-fire method for the smoke to effectively hide what you want hidden from the enemy.
It doesn't help that (AFAIK) by default, the AI doesn't really know what suppressive fire is, so in 99/100 PvAI situations, deploying smoke almost anywhere completely stops incoming fire, causing it to be considered a good and valid tactic.


Regarding blinding the tank though:
I know thermals are often removed to not make vehicles overly OP, but if they had it, smoke should not be a factor to them, since they should be able to look right through it. Hopefully, with the Tanks DLC now released, armoured units will get some more opposition and might see their full functionality return?
[Ben]
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by [Ben] »

Also check wind. Too many times has someone thrown a smoke and then been disappointed with where the smoke actually covers because wind strength and direction was not taken into account. Shift + K is your friend.
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StRiKeR
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by StRiKeR »

[Ben] wrote: Sat Apr 14, 2018 1:53 pm Also check wind. Too many times has someone thrown a smoke and then been disappointed with where the smoke actually covers because wind strength and direction was not taken into account. Shift + K is your friend.
This is very true. On top of that I would like to urge mission makers to think about their wind and weather settings. Many times missions will add a plethora of smoke equipment to your inventory yet some strong wind settings (why?) make those utterly useless. Wind doesn't add much for us in ArmA. It just makes things more difficult. Please use it moderately and test its effects. Bad weather is fine, but winds that make smoke immediately disappear into the ground is a little strange.
ashley
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by ashley »

It would help if smoke grenades actually worked properly in Arma. Strong winds don't have such a high impact on smoke grenades in reality as they do in Arma. Plus the fact we don't have any white/red phosphorus smoke grenades makes using them in high winds a little hard.

In my opinion, turn strong winds off unless you have a sniper team that needs to make long shots.

While all your points are valid striker they should all be taken on a case by case basis. A smoke grenade that blocks a tanks vision might have just saved 10 friendly troops.
Cobra. wrote: Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:11 pm Even if you have a man down, throw fucking smoke on the enemy not onto him.
Again this conclusion relies on case by case analysis. If you have a man down and there is contact North, West and East at medium range it is hard to place smoke, the most efficient method is to smoke your own position to conceal what you are doing, fallback to a better position and regroup.

Deploying smoke on your own position is also a very good way to displace enemy positions. If they have you pinned and you deploy smoke on your position they are forced to move some of their force to cover your possible escape routes through smoke freeing your allies up to flank or push.

There is a huge misunderstanding on all aspects on how to use smokes from everyone in the community.
Rory
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by Rory »

People do seem to use smokes stupidly on the offense. I agree with the first two points.

Although for the third point. If men start going down your first worry shouldn't be about if you fuck up someone else's view. Due to Arma, In most situations obscuring yourself from the enemy is going to save more lives immediately than a fire team or squad trying to cover you or suppress the enemy.

It would be nice if we tried to collect wounded rather than just leave them, smoke helps with that.
Tom
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by Tom »

. Too many times I see numpties running across an opening while throwing smokes in front of them
This by itself is a staple of the community.
Either we perfect it to an art form or we get away from it.

There haven't been open field charges since WW1 or on the russian front, maybe...
Tom
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by Tom »

We did it again! Full platoon over an open field instead of taking the Forrest route... at least we didn’t smoke our selves. Oh...
[Ben]
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by [Ben] »

Tom wrote: Thu Apr 26, 2018 6:41 am We did it again! Full platoon over an open field instead of taking the Forrest route... at least we didn’t smoke our selves. Oh...
Every time we have taken the forest route down the steeper hill we have suffered far more casualties. :P

If the anit-flubber script was in there it would have been a lot more effective. At least a third of our smoke bounced behind the target. :(
You couldn't script your way out of a cardboard box.
Cobra.
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by Cobra. »

Anybody know if Blastcore still breaks smoke? Previously it would just pool in one spot and look dumb.
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OldManVegas
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Re: On the usage of Smoke Grenades

Post by OldManVegas »

DYAFTB
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